GYMN-L Digest - 6 Apr 1995
There are 11 messages
totalling 355 lines in this issue.
Topics of
the day:
1. peachtree timre
2. Mtn Pac /
Mark Booth
3. substituting gymnasts (was tv
overkill)
4. FLOOR QUESTIONS
AND COMMENTS:
5.
Negativity
6. Opinion
poll
7. 1995 Gymnix International report
8. ESPN/Peachtree
9. New Ideas (2)
10. Late mail... (problems
in system)
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Date: Thu, 6 Apr 1995 15:22:32
-0400
From: ***@PRISM.GATECH.EDU
Subject:
peachtree timre
is the peachtree being aired again
on friday night/saturday
morning or
saturday
night/sunday morning???the
3;30 am thing threw me! adrienne
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 6 Apr 1995 14:16:11
-0700
From: ***@NETCOM.COM
Subject:
Re: Mtn Pac / Mark Booth
>
> Mark
Booth had several very devastating injuries that would have knocked
> most people write out of competitive gymnastics. At regionals in Oklahoma
> he broke both ankles on landing his fullin
on floor. he
stuck it, and then
just
> fell down. Two years later, at the same meet, at
the same gym, he broke his
> achilles
on his opening tumbling pass. Also,
did he have shoulder surgery?
> I do agree with a lack of fire,
though. There were many meets where
i saw him
> warming
up an amazing whip to full-in (much higher than anyone elses
full-in
from
>
handspring), and then he would just implode
mentally. one
of two things would
> happen in the meet. he would either
scratch completely, or he would water
down
> his set.
>
> Since the subject of this message
is mtn pacific stuff, i
will include
something
from
> that first meet. It was floor finals, and mark could have
easily won it, but
after
> his second pass, he
was a little off balance, and stepped out of bounds. he
rolled
> his eyes for the rest of his set, with a shit eating grin on
his face. one
tiny
mistake
> and he throws the whole routine in
the garbage. he
still ended up getting
> third on floor.
>
>
josh
Well I watered down my words for that
post because i have been skewered
for my choice of words in the past.....
But now JOSH
said it so I can blame HIM !
(neener neener...)
Yeah
"mentally imploded" is EXACTLY what I meant.
He just gives up without
a FIGHT !
Nice guy but so fragile, drives my
crazy.
I wish there was some way to make him more of a fighter.
(Now
I just hope no one quotes this list to him and stir up a hornets nest
and get him pissed at me)
------------------------------
Date:
Thu, 6 Apr 1995
14:32:15 -0700
From:
***@ASU.EDU
Subject: Re: substituting gymnasts (was tv overkill)
>
> > >i am looking for opinions here-
what do y'all think about the way the
> > >'soviets'
used to sub in people if the 'good' gymnast did not make
> > >finals-like in '90 Goodwill Games when svetlana
was 'subbed' for
> >
> >
Well this was not a 'Soviet' trick.
Other teams do it just as
> > much,
even at Goodwill '90 AA there were like two other teams that did it.
>
>
As I recall, it was a Soviet "trick" until about '89 or '90. Does anyone
> remember
whether anyone else did this (or at least did it with such
> regularity) before that time?
Well
I can only think of one main time before '89, and that was
'85 when Moste and Baraksonova were pulled
for Shush and Omelianchik
(European
Champ and USSR National Champ resp.). The latter both had
mistakes on bars in the team competition, but were replaced
into the AA
and then tied for 1st. But you have to remember that their previous
scores carried
over into AA finals, so they were substituted in with a
handicap. Also that would mean no medals on bars
for the Soviets, since
Yurtchenko also fell in
prelims and after M and B were replaced they were
disqualified
from further competition.
So
really when I think about this case it doesn't seem that the
USSR was being
"ruthless" or evil or cheating in any way, but were getting
around the ridiculous rules that kept their gymnasts out
from finals.
Like I said, teams with depth should not be punished because
of it. I'm
sorry
but the USSR would have won anyway (Szabo fell her
first event in),
it was just up to them to decide
who. Kersten
World AA champ I think not.
This
was just a famous case, especially since they made history by
tying for first, but anyway I was sure I had a point, oh yes
when else did
they substitute gymnasts before
Goodwill '90? Europeans
or anything?
Amanda
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 6 Apr 1995 17:24:52
-0400
From: ***@PRISM.GATECH.EDU
Subject:
FLOOR QUESTIONS AND COMMENTS:
Comments about Peachtree,( This got posted wrong, so I'm reposting.)
1)Shannon:
I have to agree that the new routine
looks alot better than her
old, especially
the tumbling. I am still waiting for that Double layout that
Steve referred to at Barcelona that
Shannon was working
on. BTW: I don't know this so I am asking, SO DON't FLAME ME!!!!:
Shannon did a first pass of RO, whip,whip, ff,ff,
tucked full in.
My
question is about the value of the sequence. How much bonus does
she get for
this pass? Does the two whips upgrade the tucked full-in to an
E (or is it already?), Is there a value
difference between atucked and
piked
full-in? How about a Double layout and a double that was layout on the
first and a
pike on the second?
2) The
becoming more common front tumbling:
I was rather impressed that Phelps did a
front stepout, front
handspring
double front (though she landed on her butt.) I am still
waiting for
some one to best Olga Strahzeva's combo: Fronthandspring-front
flip-flop-double
front-foward roll-immediate FF w a 1/2 turn, RO, FF,
FF,
arabian 1 and 3/4 roll out. (I know that the arabian is now
not allowed,but it was at USA vs. USSR ('88) and you have to
admit:
THAT'S One Hell
of a TOUCH SEQUENCE!)
(What about back tumbling: Anyone seen
Natalia Frolova's combo beat yet:
RO FF 1 & 1/2 RO FF 3/1 twist ! How does she stand still after all that
twisting!!!)
3)
Best Floor:
I would have to give best floor tumbling to Olga Strahzeva (see above), where
as
best artistry would go to Boginskya, without a doubt
in my mind. Her
movements are just beautiful.
Jeff
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 6 Apr 1995 15:25:46 -0700
From: ***@LELAND.STANFORD.EDU
Subject:
Negativity
Hi Everyone,
I have not written before, but I have
been reading a lot of negative posts
lately that
have inspired me to respond. I am a
recently retired Stanford
gymnast, and have been
quite dismayed by the negative comments regarding college
gymnastics that
I have seen posted recently. People
need to keep in mind that
college gymnasts' bodies can not take the kind of training
that 12-year-old
bodies can, and therefore, the
skill level in college gymnastics is often a
bit
lower than our top elite competitors.
In addition, I was shocked to hear
criticism
of the form of the college competitors.
I have found that division
one college
gymnasts on the whole have MUCH cleaner form and show more
maturityin
their dance and performance quality than many of our level ten and
elite
gymnasts. It is
true that some form breaks are overlooked, but we all know
that form breaks are often overlooked even in world class
competitions.
College gymnasts should be appreciated for their grace,
style, and longstanding
committment
and dedication to our sport, not condemned because they are scored
slightly higher than our elites. College gymnasts are rewarded for showing
polish and originality as well as sheer daredevil
trick. This must be realized
in order to understand college scoring (or shall I say have
a clue as to how
the gymnasts are scored.)
I
would also like to respond to the comments regarding Mark Booth. Mark is an
incredibly
talented athlete. He can do things
that I have never seen any other
gymnast (male or
female) do. Mark has had many
injuries while he has been at
Stanford, and this is what is
responsible for his performance problems.
Several people have commented
that Mark "lacks fire", but I see it as a lack
of
confidence in the face of injury.
Mark has a classic case of what those
familiar
with sports psychology know as performance anxiety. Put simply, Mark
get
nervous when he is out there and just freezes up. He has been working a
lot on this lately, and I hope that he can put it into
practice on the
competition floor. Yes, Mark has seen many of his teammates
pass him by, and
this is frustrating and blow to one's confidence. He has not been passed by
due to a lack of fire, however. Injuries and nerves have been Mark's
nemeses
and I hope that he can overcome
them......Do not write him off just yet.
Jen
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 6 Apr 1995 17:35:52
-0500
From: ***@MAIL.COIN.MISSOURI.EDU
Subject:
Re: Opinion poll
On Thurs.March 6, 1995 Cole
writes:
> OK. Here's
one for all of you that should get your minds going...
>
> All
the talk recently about Shannon's new floor routine inspired a thought :
>
> Whose floor routine do you think
was the BEST of all time? I know, I
know,
> it's
> a
tough call but it should generate a lot of discussion! Here are my picks :
>
>
>
Cole
> --- End Included Message ---
>
IMHO, the best
floor routines ever were a tie between Mary Lou Retton's
1984
Olympics routine (forgot music to it) and Kim Zmeskal's
"Rock Around
the Clock & Johnny B.
Goode" routine.
--Michael
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 6 Apr 1995 18:44:50
-0400
From: ***@AOL.COM
Subject:
Re: 1995 Gymnix International report
>Shapornaya was tall and long, but pretty much an average
Soviet gymnast.
Is there such a thing?
>VAULT 1-Podkopayeva 9.750, 2-Cousineau
9.4125, 3-O.Yurkina 9.400
A *Yurkina* in
vault finals?!?!?!?!?
Mara
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 6 Apr 1995 20:23:34
-0400
From: ***@AOL.COM
Subject:
ESPN/Peachtree
I think Maura D used to be a gymnast for UCLA. She and
the guy commentated
for the gold spectacular back
in december.
Bart and kathy j.
also
commentated for goodwill games on TBS or
whatever station it was on. I dont
like bart at commentating. too many
"wows"
Also for stupid things at peachtree-the
guy said well be back with shannons
scores when we continue and they were on the screen in front
of shannon.
Anne
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 6 Apr 1995 20:55:34
-0400
From: ***@FIT.EDU
Subject:
Re: New Ideas
> The requirements on high bar are already harder to
get than the
> other events.
I
thought pommel horse was the hard one to get requirements for?
Or is it
just the bonus that's hard to get?
Laura
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 7 Apr 1995 09:48:00
-0600
From: ***@MEDICINE.ADELAIDE.EDU.AU
Subject:
Late mail... (problems in system)
Anne's message of 2nd April was delayed
because of confusion between
e-mail account names when logged in through different
software packages!
I hope that I manage at this attempt.
Don
Date: Sunday 2nd April 1995
Subject: Re: The Oscars
On Tue, March 28, Adriana
wrote:
>>Anyone know who she was?
I tried to get a good look at her face,
>> but
it was hard. I was thinking maybe
of Michelle Berube, but I
>> didn't
think the body type was right.<
From: Alexis -
<Xrose@AOL.COM>
> It was Michelle Berube. Last night EXTRA did a special report
on
> her dancing in the Oscar show and showed a clip of the rehersal of
> the
Lion King number.
The announcer on Australian TV said it was KASUMI TAKAHASHI who
was
the individual RSG gymnast in the Lion King item. Kasumi won
5 Gold medals in the
Commonwealth Games in Vancouver, Canada whilst
representing
Australia. She trains and lives in
Los Angeles and is
a beautiful and artistic 14 year old
gymnast. Her mother is
Australian
and her father Japanese - internationally she represents
Australia.
Concerning the current discussions about the Australian Olympic
Athlete
Plan: Each Olympic sport has been asked to put
together a plan to
ensure Australia competes well in the 2000
Olympics in Sydney.
The Australian Gymnastic Federation Plan is quite ambitious in
gymnastic
terms. To ensure
the success of the plan and give the talented gymnasts
who
desire to be part of the team in 2000 a chance to achieve their goals,
a
national plan including many specialist coaches, upgraded facilities and
much
attention to the education and welfare of the children is being
implemented. From 1997 National squad gymnasts
working towards 2000
(ie turning 13 in
1997) may be invited to train at the National Training
Centre for varying periods
of time. The gymnast and her family
will
always have a choice to relocate (with or without her
family) or to train
in her State High Performance Centre. The A.G.F. believes that the total
development
of the gymnast should always be of prime importance. It also
has
an obligation to offer Australia's talented boys and girls every
opportunity
to achieve their goals.
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 6 Apr 1995 22:03:31
EDT
From: ***@MIT.EDU
Subject:
Re: New Ideas
On Pommel Horse the requirements are:
a one pommel B, 2 scissors, and a B on each end of the
horse.
On High Bar the requirements are:
a
release B, a elgrip B, and a in-bar B.
Eventhough I find Pommel Horse the most difficult
event
I think High Bar's requirements are harder.
Chris
------------------------------
End
of GYMN-L Digest - 6 Apr 1995
*********************************