gymn Digest Fri, 26 Aug 94 Volume 3 : Issue 4

Today's Topics:
10's in '84 Olympics (3 msgs)
10's in 84
CG Men's Team Competition Full Results
Chainey Umphrey
Commonwealth Games Intro
Commonwealth Mens Apparatus
Commonwealth Womens Apparatus (2 msgs)
Equipment (2 msgs)
Fwd: Re: training of gymn...
Germany, east v. west (2 msgs)
Gymn Reporter for USA Nationals
Junior Nationals results
Men's Nationals scores
Nationals?
Nationals results (compulsories)
NCAA Men's Letters
News from Japan
Reeder headline news
Re Japan News
Sr women's compulsories
Trivia answers
Trivia Answers #20 (2 msgs)
Trivia Questions #20 - Error
TV Guide
Understanding of Gymnastics (2 msgs)
unfactored scores
USAs, other compulsories
US compulsory scores
Wendy Bruce
Whatever happened to... (Re: Junior Nationals results)
woodward report

This is a digest of the gymn@athena.mit.edu mailing list.

----------------------------------------------------------------------

Date: Tue, 23 Aug 94 12:46:56 EDT
From: ***@aol.com
Subject: 10's in '84 Olympics

Why were so many 10's given out in 1984, and so little given out in years
there after?

Jessica

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 23 Aug 94 23:51:46 EDT
From: ***@aol.com
Subject: 10's in '84 Olympics

>Why were so many 10's given out in 1984, and so little given out in years
there after?

The flood started in '84, but to be fair there were quite a few 10s in '88
also.

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 24 Aug 1994 12:42:32 -0400 (EDT)
From: ***@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu
Subject: 10's in '84 Olympics

>
> >Why were so many 10's given out in 1984, and so little given out in years
> there after?
>
> The flood started in '84, but to be fair there were quite a few 10s in '88
> also.
>
That's for sure - and for routines with glaring errors no less. Remember
Dagmar Kerstan's bars?

Beth

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 23 Aug 94 15:14 PDT
From: ***@MVS.OAC.UCLA.EDU
Subject: 10's in 84

There were so many tens because it was in the US, and here if a landing
is stuck the audience demands a 10.

Also the Chinese men in 84 were gymnastics gods.

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 24 Aug 1994 21:17:39 UTC-0700
From: ***@cs.ubc.ca
Subject: CG Men's Team Competition Full Results

(CG = Commonwealth Games)
(AUS = Australia, BAR = Barbados, CAN = Canada, CYP = Cyprus, ENG = England,
HKG =Hong Kong, MAS = Malaysia, NGR = Nigeria, NIR = Northern Ireland,
NMB = Namibia, NZL = New Zealand, RSA = Republic of South Africa,
SCO = Scotland, SWZ = Swaziland, WAL = Wales)

'A' indicates that gymnast advances to Individual All-around competition (top
24 with a limit of 3 per country). 'R' indicates that the gymnast is a reserve
for the Individual All-around competition.

Name Country Floor Pommels Rings Vault PBars HBar
Total
1A Neil Thomas ENG 9.500 9.000 9.050 9.725 8.950 9.000
55.225
2A Brennon Dowrick AUS 9.050 8.800 9.100 9.250 9.400 9.500
55.100
3A Kristan Burley CAN 9.550 8.700 9.050 9.300 9.100 9.150
54.850
4A Alan Nolet CAN 9.250 8.300 9.550 8.650 9.100 9.600
54.450
5A Lee McDermott ENG 8.950 8.850 9.350 9.300 9.150 8.750
54.350
6A Peter Hogan AUS 8.750 8.500 9.250 9.200 9.350 9.250
54.300
7A Richard Ikeda CAN 8.650 9.200 9.200 8.900 8.700 9.500
54.150
8A Bret Hudson AUS 9.100 8.400 8.900 9.500 8.750 9.150
53.800
9. Nathan Kingston AUS 8.750 9.450 8.550 8.800 8.850 9.300
53.700
10. Travis Romagnoli CAN 9.100 8.150 8.950 9.300 8.650 9.300
53.450
11A Colin Close NIR 8.000 9.050 8.500 8.900 8.850 8.900
52.200
T12A Steven Frew SCO 8.650 8.550 8.100 9.050 8.550 9.100
52.000
T12A Gareth Irwin WAL 8.650 8.450 8.250 8.900 8.750 9.000
52.000
14A Robert Barber ENG 8.900 7.650 8.700 8.900 8.400 9.200
51.750
15A Dewald Laubscher RSA 8.600 8.400 8.100 9.150 8.350 8.550
51.150
16A Johan Van Heerden RSA 8.450 8.200 8.400 8.850 8.300 8.350
50.550
17A Craig Bruce NZL 8.750 8.400 6.950 9.250 8.150 8.350
49.850
18A Adrian Steyn RSA 7.850 7.950 7.850 9.200 8.250 8.650
49.750
19A Mark Lister NZL 8.700 7.350 8.450 9.250 7.500 8.400
49.650
20A Nicholas Dunn NIR 8.450 8.250 8.400 8.950 7.800 7.700
49.550
21A Tak Ming Lee HKG 8.300 8.050 7.950 8.650 7.900 8.650
49.500
22A Derek Callahan SCO 8.300 7.750 8.150 9.100 8.150 7.950
49.400
23A Sean Grosvenor BAR 8.600 6.550 7.900 8.950 8.500 8.800
49.300
24A Gareth Davies WAL 7.850 8.150 8.300 8.100 7.300 8.300
48.000
25A Andrew Tombs WAL 8.100 6.250 7.300 8.800 7.950 7.750
46.150
26A Kim Fai Wong HKG 7.300 7.250 7.000 9.100 7.650 6.900
45.200
27R Nobleman Motsa SWZ 8.100 5.700 7.750 8.150 7.100 7.250
44.050
28R* H. Georgallas CYP 8.400 5.500 7.250 8.850 7.000 6.650
43.650
29. Soon Hui Khor MAS 7.950 5.950 6.350 8.300 7.650 7.000
43.200
30. Kindsley Eragbhe NGR 8.700 5.250 5.850 9.350 7.450 6.200
42.800
31. Chung Yuen Lok HKG 8.400 5.500 6.250 8.600 7.300 5.000
41.050
32. Innocent Eragbhe NGR 8.150 4.800 5.050 9.300 6.900 5.850
40.050
33. Freddy Ligthelm NMB 7.400 4.650 5.400 8.150 6.700 5.700
38.000
34. Marco Dainat NMB 6.700 4.950 5.050 8.250 5.900 5.150
36.000
35**Paul Bowler ENG 6.300 0.000 0.000 9.500 8.850 8.700
33.350
36. Cletus Okpoh NGR 8.750 5.100 5.350 0.000 7.550 5.550
32.300
Kwok Keung Leung from Hong Kong and Augustine Idahosa of Nigeria did not
compete.

* I can't find a first name for this gymnast on any of the printouts that I
have. I'll try to find out his first name when I'm back in Victoria.

** Paul Bowler was injured during the competition and did not perform on
pommels or rings.

Team Scores

Team Floor Pommels Rings Vault PBars HBar Total
1. Canada 27.900 26.200 27.800 27.500 26.900 28.400 164.700
2. Australia 26.900 26.750 27.250 27.950 27.600 28.050 164.500
3. England 27.350 25.500 27.100 28.525 26.950 26.950 162.375
4. South Africa 24.900 24.550 24.350 27.200 24.900 25.550 151.450
5. Wales 24.600 22.850 23.850 25.800 24.000 25.050 146.150
6. Hong Kong 24.000 20.800 21.200 26.350 22.850 20.550 135.750
7. Nigeria 25.600 15.150 16.250 18.650 21.900 17.600 115.150

The rest of the countries did not have enough competitors to field teams.
New Zealand had 2, Scotland had 2, Cyprus had 1, Barbados had 1, Swaziland
had 1, Malaysia had 1 and Northern Ireland had 2.

Karen
(kuder@cs.ubc.ca)

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 25 Aug 94 19:03:11 EDT
From: ***@aol.com
Subject: Chainey Umphrey

USA Today reports that a problematic PH set left Chainey in 17th place after
compos

Mara

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 24 Aug 1994 14:48:49 UTC-0700
From: ***@cs.ubc.ca
Subject: Commonwealth Games Intro

Hi everyone,
I've returned from Victoria and my first stint as a Gymn reporter. I
attended all of the sessions of the artistic gymnastics competition at the
XV Commonwealth Games. I have lots of notes and results that I'll be
typing in and posting over the next week. My computer access in Victoria
fell through and my travel plans were disrupted, so I must apologize that
there is such a delay with these reports. I'll be heading back to Victoria
tomorrow to cover the rhythmic gymnastics, so there will be a few days of
silence again.
In addition to the scores, routine comments and transcripts of the
press conferences that I'll be posting, I have a lot of other information
that I'll only post if people are interested. I have a list of judges for
the various events and a breakdown of all of the scores by judges for the
various events. If you want to see any of this, please email me. If only
1 or 2 people request it, I'll email them directly. If I get a lot of
requests for any of this stuff, I'll send it to the entire list.
I met fellow Gymner Nancy Raymond who was at the meet taking pictures
for IG. She had emailed me in advance to let me know that she would be
there so I was on the lookout for her.
I'll try to make my reports as complete and clear as possible, but if you
have any questions, email me and I'll try to answer them.

Karen

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 22 Aug 94 22:35:08 BST
From: ***@ic.ac.uk
Subject: Commonwealth Mens Apparatus

Commonwealth Games Mens Apparatus Finals Medals Winners:

Floor
1. Neil Thomas (ENG) 9.662
2. Kristan Burley (CAN) 9.437
3. Alan Nolet (CAN) 9.150

Pommel Horse
1. Brennon Dowrick (AUS) 9.425
2. Nathan Kingston (AUS) 9.400
3. Richard Ikeda (CAN) 9.225

Rings
1. Lee McDermott (ENG) 9.475
2. Peter Hogan (AUS) 9.275
3. Brennon Dowrick (AUS) 9.150
3. Richard Ikeda (CAN) 9.150

Vault
1. Bret Hudson (AUS) 9.375
2. Kristan Burley (CAN) 9.312
3. Neil Thomas (ENG) 9.306

Parallel Bars
1. Peter Hogan (AUS) 9.400
2. Kristan Burley (CAN) 9.350
3. Brennon Dowrick (AUS) 9.250

High Bar
1. Alan Nolet (CAN) 9.512
2. Richard Ikeda (CAN) 9.500
3. Nathan Kingston (AUS) 9.325

I am happy with the two Gold medal that England had won here but am a
bit disappointed that we didn't win many minor medals (Only one other
bronze from Thomas on VT). Neil was fourth on both parallel bars and
high bar I think. Lee McDermott's favourite apparatus, the rings, yields
a gold for him. He is only 20 and may well have a good future ahead of
him.

More to come later with the womens apparatus finals.

Sherwin

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 23 Aug 94 3:01:37 BST
From: ***@ic.ac.uk
Subject: Commonwealth Womens Apparatus

Commonwealth Games Womens Apparatus Finals Results:

Vault:
1. Stella Umeh (CAN) 9.556
2. Sonia Lawrence (WAL) 9.543
3. Lisa Simes (CAN) 9.506

Uneven Bars:
1. Rebecca Stoyel (AUS) 9.525
2. Stella Umeh (CAN) 9.450
3. Sarah Thompson (NZL) 9.337

Beam:
1. Salli Wills (AUS) 9.075
2. Zita Lusack (ENG) 8.987
3. Ruth Moniz (AUS) 8.900

Floor:
1. Annika Reeder (ENG) 9.750
2. Jackie Brady (ENG) 9.662
3. Lisa Simes (CAN) 9.550

Stella Umeh had a mixed day on her last appearance in international
gymnastics. She won the vault, then thought that she had also won the
bars when the gymnasts marched off, but her scores were later adjusted
because the initial starting value was deemed too high, and as a result
Rebecca Stoyel of Australia was promoted to gold.

On beam everybody excpet Salli Wills fell off and thus not surprisingly
she won the title. (Ooops, not a very good representation of Commonwealth
gymnastics here) The floors were much better with Reeder and Brady made it
an English one-two.

That's the end of the Commonwealth Games artistic gymnastics championships.
Goodnight all and it all starts again in 1998 in Malaysia.

Sherwin

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 23 Aug 1994 12:41:45 +1000
From: ***@cs.anu.edu.au
Subject: Commonwealth Womens Apparatus

Sherwin writes:

>Uneven Bars:
>1. Rebecca Stoyel (AUS) 9.525
[...]
>Beam:
>1. Salli Wills (AUS) 9.075
>2. Zita Lusack (ENG) 8.987
>3. Ruth Moniz (AUS) 8.900

When I took my daughter (Amy - 5.5yrs) to gym yesterday afternoon, the
whole club was buzzing with the news of Rebecca Stoyel's silver medal
in the All-Round competition. (The results had just been faxed through.)
Seeing these latest results I think Australia has done very well in the
gymnastics - especially considering that our two strongest competitors
did not compete in the All-Round or Individual's due to injuries. (I
understand that Joanna Hughes most recent injury was to an arm or
elbow - no details.)

Seeing these results and those of our men will undoubtably give a
tremendous boost of encouragement to young gymnasts throughout Australia.

Several weeks back we went to see the final of the Commonwealth Games
Selection Trials at the Australian Institute of Sport indoor stadium.
Apart from being able to see these fine young women and men perform,
we were also treated to a display of children who are receiving training
for future events. These children (about 8 years old) receive 20 hours
training per week and love it. Watch out world when the 2000 Olympics
in Sydney, Australia come round :-)!

BTW, when and where is the next World Championships competition?

Cheers,

Drew.

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 23 Aug 94 07:39:01 -0400
From: ***@a1.csoc.umc.dupont.com
Subject: Equipment

[This message is converted from WPS-PLUS to ASCII]

Hi Gymn,

My name is Jim, and I've been lurking around here
for a couple of months. This mailing list has been really
valuable in helping me get back in touch with who's doing what in
international competition. I was away from gymnastics for about
15 years, and then somehow got involved in coaching last year.

To make a long story short, the gym I was working at went
out of business last week, and Paula (a fellow Gymn'er) and I are
going to start our own studio. What I really need is a name and
possibly a phone number of someone who deals in used equipment.
Ideally this would be someone in the New York-Washington D.C.
corridor so I could pick up the equipment myself. It also might
be nice to look at what we are buying beforehand.

If anyone out there could help get me started on this I
would really appreciate it. Another thing that would be great is
if some of you could post any war stories about opening your gym
or one that you were involved in starting. I'm sure that Paula
and I will have plenty of our own to share after all the dust
settles. You see, we are planning to open the new gym three
weeks from yesterday. Go ahead and laugh, but that's really what
we're planning. Talk to ya soon.

Jim

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 24 Aug 1994 22:32:35 -0700 (PDT)
From: ***@netcom.com
Subject: Equipment

James R. Mott
> Hi Gymn,
>
> My name is Jim Mott, and I've been lurking around here
> for a couple of months. This mailing list has been really
> valuable in helping me get back in touch with who's doing what in
> international competition. I was away from gymnastics for about
> 15 years, and then somehow got involved in coaching last year.
>
> To make a long story short, the gym I was working at went
> out of business last week, and Paula (a fellow Gymn'er) and I are
> going to start our own studio. What I really need is a name and
> possibly a phone number of someone who deals in used equipment.
> Ideally this would be someone in the New York-Washington D.C.
> corridor so I could pick up the equipment myself. It also might
> be nice to look at what we are buying beforehand.
>
> If anyone out there could help get me started on this I
> would really appreciate it. Another thing that would be great is
> if some of you could post any war stories about opening your gym
> or one that you were involved in starting. I'm sure that Paula
> and I will have plenty of our own to share after all the dust
> settles. You see, we are planning to open the new gym three
> weeks from yesterday. Go ahead and laugh, but that's really what
> we're planning. Talk to ya soon.
>
Is the dust you speak of "chalk dust " ? HAHAHAH!

Look under sporting goods-used in the yellow pages.

See if any local schools have grae left over from when the scrapped their
programs. I know CSC bagged a bunch of stuff after Lynbrook HS killed
their program. The gear sat around till Dave called the school dist office
up and made them a deal.

They probably wont be able to help you but may know who has what you need.
Consider biting the bullet for new carpet on the rebound floor.
Used carpet just doesnt make it.
Also do a bit of research on the springs. Worn springs may cause you grief.

Your floor is made up of several sheets on 1 inch wafer board sitting on a bed
of springs that look like automotive valve springs.

These sprindgs are much smaller but way stiffer than springboard springs.
Floor springs are like 1-1/2 in dia by about 4 or 5 in long.
Something like that. Its been 2 years since I had one apart.

The frame around the floor is solid but covered with padding.
Somebody whap me if Im wrong but I believe a rebound floor to be composed of
3 rows of 5 sheets of theis waferboard. 4x8 feet each.
So I think it comes out to 20 feet by 24 feet. The sheets each have clips that
hold them together loosely.

----------------------------
wwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwww | wwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwww
---------------------------

The w are the waferboard. The rest is the cross sectional of the clip.

Each edge that abuts another sheet has 2 such clips so a corner sheet has
clips on only 2 sides where a center sheet has 2 clips on each of 4 sides.
No clips between outside frame and the floor sheets.

Often what happens is the floors get sold for scrap lumber and the springs
get sold for scrap steel. Carpet ends up in dumpster or given to the wrestling
team.

Just offhand, do you know what gymnastics aparatus weighs ?
When we moved CSC we actually used hydraulic rolling jacks sometimes.
If you have a msall army of high school guys around, you will find tham most
helpful. What you have in mind is doable, but I fear you drastically under
estimate the effort involved. You will do it, and then you will die a painful
slow death as soon as the adrenyline rush fades.

Go ahead and open, but consider opening without a full compliment of aparatus.

Start with a rebound floor (it may take over 3 weeks to get the carpet delivered
and you DO want the genuine stuff in case you host a guest team) although
this may be a problem. Floor and LOTS of safety mats I would consider the
most essential to open a gymn. Until you can buy a still ring frame, you
can gey by with proper hardware set in the ceiling. Dont cheat here though.
Go hog wild at a marine chandlers and play with 1-1/2 dia shanks on your
eyebolts. Remember you are playing with peoples lives here.
Digging a vault pit will be expensive. If you have enough height,
build a freestanding deck above the floor. Use HEAVY timbers like for railroad
trestles. (Got any architects/civil engineers amongst the parents ?)

Hi bar uneven or pbars better buy them. You can improvise your own but a
friends recent accident scares me off of that.

Do some homework but I think that if you have the expertise a raised vault pit
can be built cheaply and you may be forced to build your own rebound floor.
The springs will be the hardest thing to find. The rest a good carpenter can
do.
Someone else provided the springs, I built the whole floor in a day.
Go for it if you can.

Oh last, I wish to caution you against using wrestling mats for tumbling.
A year ago I would have said do it. Now I think its a bad idea.

Have you and all your cohorts gotten your USGF safety certificates ?
You should all have passed the test and have your certificates hanging on the
wall before you open.

One last shot, since you ARE in the drivers seat, have you made provision for
any adult programs ? USGF has an attitude that after college you are too washe
up to be doing gymn. Hence there is no USGF masters program. I beseach you
to be open to some sort of adult session like at least one night a week
even just a 2 hr slot. Theres alot of us old duffers who are ready to hang up
our grips ONLY when they pry them off our cold dead bodies !

-texx

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 22 Aug 94 21:51:33 PDT
From: ***@eworld.com
Subject: Fwd: Re: training of gymn...

'Nuff said.

David

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 25 Aug 94 14:46:09 EST
From: ***@email.cfr.org
Subject: Germany, east v. west

Beth wrote in response to the amount of 10s during the '84 Olympics:
>That's for sure - and for routines with glaring errors no less. Remember
Dagmar Kerstan's bars?

This is a bit off the beaten path from the discussions that will follow on
the Nationals, but what ever happened to Germany in competition? Seems
the union of east and west has put a severe damper on the level of competition,
more so than the break-up of the U.S.S.R. and the "new" politics in Romania.
E. Germany was sometimes a bit "funereal" in demeanor at times (which can be
said for alot of teams from that part of the world then), but they always
put on a good fight. I have read of the messy business with the opening of
secret files condemning athletes for working with the secret police, and
the difficulties of west Germany accepting some coaches/methods from the
east. I wonder if anyone has heard of some resurgence going on at the
developmental level.....new blood to take the reigns from the "Maxi Gnauks"
(sp?) of the past.

Just wondering.....

Connie

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 25 Aug 94 23:47:22 EDT
From: ***@aol.com
Subject: Germany, east v. west

>Seems the union of east and west has put a severe damper on the level of
competition,

In the last 4 years or so of the DDR, it seemed the competition was more
behind the judging table than on the competition floor! It was well past
time for Ellen Berger to resign when she finally did in '92.

Bronze in '87 and '88 were jokes, as was 5th place in 1989. A few
individuals such as Gnauck and yes, Kersten, aside - I'm not sorry to see the
last of the DDR.

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 23 Aug 1994 08:30:47 -0500 (CDT)
From: ***@owlnet.rice.edu
Subject: Gymn Reporter for USA Nationals

Hey all,

This is just another of those little announcements to say that yours
truly will be the Gymn reporter for USA Nationals. I will be there
only from Thursday afternoon on, so unfortunately will miss all of the
Jr. Women's event. However, I will be covering all optionals and
event finals.

I've received a few notes from people saying "hey, let's get together"
-- let me say that I'd love to, but my schedule is pretty tight when
I'm there, so if it doesn't happen -- sorry!

Rachele

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 25 Aug 94 18:44:04 EDT
From: ***@aol.com
Subject: Junior Nationals results

Hi everyone. I just got back from the optional portion of the Junior
National Championships. As I didn't see results posted, I decided to post
the new Junior National Team (the top 12 finishers). They didn't announce
who came in where after the top 12. Well, here goes...

1. Dominique Moceanu 75.90
2. Doni Thompson 75.27
3. Mary Beth Arnold 73.27
4. Kristy Powell 73.81
5. Mina Kim 73.01
6. Andree Pickens 72.95
7. Tara Tagliarino 72.82
8. Katie Teft 72.68
9. Kristin Maloney 72.64
10. Deidra Graham 72.26
11. Monica Flammer 72.17
12. Marissa Medal 71.83

And the event medalists...
Vault:
1. Dominique Moceanu 19.18
2. Doni Thompson 18.74
3. Andree Pickens 18.71

Bars:
1. Mary Beth Arnold 19.24
2. Deidra Graham 19.00
3. Dominique Moceanu 18.73

Beam:
1. Mina Kim 18.98
2. Doni Thompson 18.84
3. Dominique Moceanu 18.73

Floor:
1(t). Kristy Powell 19.02
1(t). Dominique Moceanu 19.02
3. Doni Thompson 18.83

Moceanu started on beam and promptly fell off on her front tuck mount. But
after that, she did everything without a wobble (ff-three layouts, front
tuck, roundoff-double back) for a 9.20. Her troubles weren't over yet, as
she stepped just barely out of bounds on a pose before her first pass. Then
she tumbled a nice **double layout**!! She got a 9.6. Vault: her first
vault was a Yurchenko-.5 to front tuck (the new "compulsory" vault for women,
but tucked). It looked like she missed her right hand. She did the same
second vault, only laid out. It was much better for a 9.725. Bars: Gienger,
Tkatchev, and a *stuck* double layout off (9.50).

Doni Thompson also looked really good. She started on bars with *3* release
moves (Tkatchev-immediate Gienger, Gienger) and a double layout dismount for
a 9.70. On beam, she did a front tuck mount, a front tuck, and a double
layout dismount (9.675). I'm sure there was a ff-layout pass in there
somewhere, but I missed it. On floor she did a triple turn, a tucked
full-in, a Rudi to a layout stepout (a la Shannon Miller--it was a popular
pass among the juniors), and a 2.5 twist-front handspring (9.625). On vault
she did two 1.5 twisting tucked Yurchenkos, landing both with only small hops
(9.55).

Mary Beth Arnold also started on bars with an uprise to handstand (a popular
move with the juniors), a Tkatchev, and a nice double layout dismount
(9.725). She started beam with a roundoff-layout mount and did a front tuck,
ff-layout-ff (wobble), and a roundoff-double back dismount (8.825). On
floor, she tumbled a tucked full-in, a Rudi through to a layout stepout, and
a triple twist (9.50). On vault she did two nice layout Yurchenkos for a
9.45.

Some other things of note: Nekia Demery showed some outstanding tumbling on
floor, doing a double layout for her first pass and a piked full-in for her
**third**!! Theresa Kulikowski did a ff-full on beam. Taryn Apgood did a
neat combination on bars. She did a Stalder facing the low bar and as she
came up, she popped off, did a back tuck, and landed facing the bars.
Kristen Stucky and Marissa Medal did handspring-double fulls on vault, which
I think are harder than a lot of the Yurchenko vaults. Deidra Graham did one
of those overused back dive-.25 pirouette, but then she went to an immediate
straddle planche, which made it really neat. Katie Teft's floor music
stopped in the middle of her first pass. It drew the audience's attention,
and to everyone's surprise, she kept going without the music! The audience
started to clap rhythmically as if to make up for the missing music. She
ended up with a 9.45. Stormy Eaton (I think it was) did a terrific job of
announcing. He explained the little cards with the start value written on
them and also explained the options that Teft's coach had after the music
stopped. The only slightly stupid thing he did was say "The gymnasts are now
moving to their last and final rotation..." :)

Well, that's about all. Again, if you want any information on any particular
gymnast, I could probably give it to you. Just write!

Lisa

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 25 Aug 94 00:03:36 EDT
From: ***@aol.com
Subject: Men's Nationals scores

A repost from AOL
**********************

Subj: Men's Compulsory Score 94-08-24 21:32:28 EDT
From: IronCross2

Here are the top 10 men's compulsory scores:
1 Mihai Bagiu 67.38
2. John Roethlisberger 67.32
3. Scott Keswick 67.260
4. Steve McCain 66.12
5. Kip Simons 65.76
6. Bill Roth 65.7 (fell off pommels and had bad ring set)
7. Casey Bryan 65.52
8. Jeff Lutz 64.62
9. Jeremy Killen 64.5
10. J.D. Reive 64.14
17. Chainey Umphry 63.24
Chris Waller had to scratch the meet because his achilies tendon has a
partial tear in it.
I'll get the final results after optionals tommarow night
Billy
****************

posted by Mara

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 24 Aug 94 18:47:09 EDT
From: ***@aol.com
Subject: Nationals?

Anyone have results from Jr Women's compos?

Mara

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 24 Aug 94 19:36:49 EDT
From: ***@aol.com
Subject: Nationals results (compulsories)

Hi folks. I'm in Nashville, Tennesee for Nationals. I've been to two
sessions so far today, the junior women's compulsories (I saw the third and
fourth session and some of
the second) and all of the men's (senior and junior) compulsories. Just a
few quick
notes, because I have to leave pretty soon for senior women's compulsories:
Moceanu
looked really good. Her presentation is nice--pointed toes, full splits,
etc. Bagiu looked
terrific!! I **love** his body line! I only saw Thompson's beam. It looked
OK, not great.
Teft had a nice bars routine (9.40) but she was really shaky on beam for
8.65. Steve
McCain had a vault that just *flew* off the horse. He must have gone a good
15 or 20
feet (9.55). Keswick was 6-for-6, Bagiu was 6-for-6, Roethlisberger was
6-for-6. Keswick
looked solid, but not spectacular. Same for Roethlisberger, but his last
event, high bar,
looked great (9.60--same score as Bagiu). Umphrey had problems on pommel
horse
especially (7.55--one fall).

The women's competition sounds like it's going to be great! Some of the
competitors
who were listed: Shannon Miller (of course), Dominique Dawes (of course),
Kerri Strug
(but I didn't see her warming up), Wendy Bruce (I *did* see her warming up),
Jennie
Thompson, Tanya Maeirs, Soni Meduna, Larissa Fontaine, Amanda Borden. So we
have
the top three from senior and junior nationals last year competing and *4*
'92 Olympians
(if Strug does indeed show up).

I haven't seen any results posted, so I thought I'd go ahead and post them.
I'm using America Online, however, and you know what it can do to Internet
mail :)! So sorry if someone has already posted these results. The first
score is the weighted score (because compulsories count for 60% of the total
score) and the second is the raw score.
(BTW, I'm not the official reporter, but Rachele isn't here yet.)

JUNIOR WOMEN'S COMPULSORIES:
1. Dominique Moceanu (Karolyi's Gymnastics) 45.480 37.900
2. Donielle Thompson (Colorado Aerials) 44.430 37.025
3. Mary Beth Arnold (Flips Gymnastics) 43.890 36.575
4. Tara Tagliarino (American Twisters) 43.680 36.400
5. Andree Pickens (Cypress Academy) 43.530 36.275
6. Kristy Powell (Colorado Aerials) 43.290 36.075
7. Katie Teft (Great Lakes) 43.080 35.900
8. Marissa Medal (American Twisters) 42.930 35.775
9. Mina Kim (Dynamo Gymnastics) 42.870 35.725
10. Deidra Graham (Olympus) 42.720 35.600
11. Monica Flammer (Cypress Academy) 42.450 35.375
12. Kristin Maloney (Parkettes) 42.360 35.300
12. Becca Whitehurst (Capital Gymnastics) 42.360 35.300
14. Lisa Geckle (CATS) 41.610 34.675
15. Taryn Apgood (Olympus) 41.400 34.500
16. Lindsay Baker (West Valley) 41.100 34.250
17. Kristen Stucky (Salto) 41.070 34.225
18. Alecia Ingram (Cincinnati Gymnastics) 40.680 33.900
19. Nicole Bongiovanni (CATS) 40.530 33.775
20. Cassidy Vreeke (Rocky Mountain) 40.470 33.725
21. Katie Taylor (Kentwood) 40.320 33.600
22. Theresa Kulikowski (Colorado Aerials) 39.840 33.200
22. Katie Dyson (Cypress Academy) 39.840 33.200
22. Raegan Tomasek (Gym-XL) 39.840 33.200
25. Kristin Jensen (Parkettes) 39.510 32.925
26. Talya Vexler (CATS) 39.300 32.750
27. Nekia Demery (Krafft Academy) 39.180 32.650
28. Onnie Willis (Puget Sound) 38.670 32.225
(If you want to know the who placed where on each event, even though it
doesn't matter
for juniors, I can send that to you)

SENIOR MEN'S COMPULSORIES
(I haven't gotten the official score sheet yet, but here are the top 6)
1. Mihai Bagiu
2. John Roethlisberger
3. Scott Keswick
4. Steve McCain
5. Kip Simons
6. Bill Roth

Well, gotta go to Senior Women's compulsories. I'm sorry this post is so
sloppy. If people are interested, I can post a little more on my impressions
instead of just scores.

Lisa

P.S. If you write me, write me at my America Online address (bccymca@aol.com
on the 'Net or Bccymca for AOL members).

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 24 Aug 94 18:47:06 EDT
From: ***@aol.com
Subject: NCAA Men's Letters

In the new issue of Technique, Ron Galimore asks those interested in the
continuation NCAA Men's gymnastics program to write to the NCAA and encourage
an extension of the moratorium for one more year. The person to write to is:

Mr. Cedric Dempsey, Executive Director
National Collegiate Athletic Association
6300 Nall Avenue
Mission KS 66202

He also asks you send him a photocopy of your letter (to be used as evidence
of interest). That address is:

Ron Galimore
USA Gymnastics
Pan American Plaza
201 S. Capitol Avenue, Suite 300
Indianapolis IN 46225

Mara

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 25 Aug 94 22:23:00 UTC
From: ***@genie.geis.com
Subject: News from Japan

This year's NHK Cup was also the trials for the Asian Games and Dortmund
Worlds. The teams are:

Asian Games:
Women: Kosuge, Sugawara, Miura, Arai, Okawa, Obata, Aya, Sekine.
Men: Tanaka, Hatakeda, Nishikawa, Chinen, Masuda, Sato, Matsunaga.

Dortmund:
Women: Kosuge, Sugawara, Miura, Okawa, Obata, Sekine, Eto.
Men: Tanaka, Hatakeda, Sato, Nishikawa, Ono, Maeda, Matsunaga.

Kosuge was the leader until the final rotation (FX) and fell on a double
layout. She ended up in 3rd behind Sugawara and Okawa. To quote my friend,
"The men's competition was terrible. Every gymnast made one or two big
mistakes."

And Mitsuo Tsukahara's son, Naoya, won the Natl. High School Champs (one of
the most important jr. meets in Japan). He trains at Tsukahara's club but
is coached by a Chinese.

Debbie


------------------------------

Date: Wed, 24 Aug 94 11:30:52 BST
From: ***@ic.ac.uk
Subject: Reeder headline news

Annika Reeder of England made it onto the front page of the UK
National newspaper "The Daily Telegraph" today with an article
titled "Golden girl takes her sport to new heights" after her
victory in the Commonwealth Games floor exercise. The article
comes with a 24cm by 13cm photo of her on the floor. Here are
some extracts from the article:

- "To start off with I was very nervous, but then it was OK,"
said Annika, whose ambition is to win the 1996 Olympics.
"The only mistake was when I did my last tumble. I don't think
too many people noticed."
"Afterwards I spoke to my mum on the telephone and she
kept saying 'well done, well done.'"

- Mrs. Reeder said her daughter was never put under pressure to go
to the gym and the family did not believe in pushing her.
"Very rarely does she say she doesn't want to go. I know
she enjoys the gymnastics. She takes it all in her stride and has
a terrific social life outside the sport."

Posted by Sherwin

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 25 Aug 94 23:47:12 EDT
From: ***@aol.com
Subject: Re Japan News

>This year's NHK Cup was also the trials for the Asian Games and Dortmund
Worlds.

If one competition served as trials for both, why are the teams slightly
different? Was there different criteria for each team?

Mara

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 25 Aug 1994 09:53:17 -0400 (EDT)
From: ***@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu
Subject: Sr women's compulsories

Just curious - what happened to Fontaine, Bruce and Strug. Did they not compete
or just do really badly?

Beth

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 22 Aug 94 19:06:28 EDT
From: ***@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu
Subject: Trivia answers

I think I have some additional answers to 2 of the questions. The
question about when the Soviets didn't win the team gold didn't specify male or
female. Didn't the men lose the gold to China in 1983? Also, about contributing
20's to team scores, what about Nadia Comaneci in the 1976 Olympics on bars?

Beth

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 22 Aug 94 18:51:25 EDT
From: ***@aol.com
Subject: Trivia Answers #20

Here are the answers:
************

A thank you for questions below: Brian (Marcus1996) #1 & #2; Susan
(stobchatay) #3 & Adriana (Gimnasta) #4 - #7.

1. What women's team had the largest drop in position from compulsories to
optionals in the 1992 Olympic Games? Where did they finish in compulsories
and overall?

Bulgaria, 6th, 12th

2. In how many (and which) Worlds since 1966 did the Soviets not win the
Team Gold?

1979, 1987

3. Which reigning European Champion and AA favorite was carried off the
floor (and out of the competition) in '87 after the last event of the team
competition?

Valeri Liukin

4. Which team has had the greatest number of 10's contribute to its team
score in a single Olympics, which year, and how many?

China, 1984, 9

5. Only 2 gymnasts have contributed 20's to their teams: who, what year, and
what events?

Lou Yun CHN, 1984, V
Shinji Morisue JPN, 1984, HB

6. Who scored the first men's Olympic 10?

Alexander Ditiatin URS

7. There have been 9 male gymnasts to achieve a 10 in compulsories in the
Olympics: who, which events, and what years?

Peter Vidmar USA, 1984, PH
Mitch Gaylord USA, 1984, PB
Li Ning CHN, 1984, PH, V
Li Xiaoping CHN, 1984, PH
Lou Yun CHN, 1984, V
Tong Fei CHN, 1984, HB
Xu Zhiqiang CHN, 1984, HB
Koji Gushiken JPN, 1984, HB
Shinji Morisue JPN, 1984, HB

8. During which Worlds did the Chinese women lead the Romanians through most
of the compulsory competition, before eventually finishing with the Bronze

1989 Stuttgart

9. From 1976 on, which year did the Romanian women not win a Team medal?

1981 4th

10. How many 10s were awarded in Women's compulsories at the 1984 Olympics?

1-Ecaterina Szabo, floor

Hope you had fun!

Mara

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 22 Aug 94 20:19:51 EDT
From: ***@aol.com
Subject: Trivia Answers #20

> There have been 9 male gymnasts to achieve a 10 in compulsories in the
Olympics: who, which events, and what years?<

Who did the research on this one? I know that Artemov got a 10.0 on PB's in
'88 and I thought he was the first male compo Olympic perfect ten ... but I
guess maybe that was just in fully attended Olympics ... when you look at
'84 who did *not* get ten's was a shorter list for just about everything.

Susan

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 22 Aug 94 21:56:15 EDT
From: ***@aol.com
Subject: Trivia Questions #20 - Error

ERROR!!! [gasp - I know you thought I was perfect...]

The two items below should have been more specific. #2 refers to women's
gymn, #5 refers to men's.

Sorry.

Mara

>2. In how many (and which) Worlds since 1966 did the Soviets not win the
Team Gold?

>5. Only 2 gymnasts have contributed 20's to their teams: who, what year,
and what events?

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 23 Aug 1994 14:14:24 -0400 (EDT)
From: ***@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu
Subject: TV Guide

Just thought I'd let everyone know that the latest issue of TV Guide has a
little story on US Nationals with quotes by David Michaels :) and a nice color
photo of Shannon. So if you don't subscribe and you're a Miller fan, I'd say
it's worth the 60 cents (or whatever TV Guide costs these days!)

Beth

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 25 Aug 94 13:04:16 EDT
From: ***@aol.com
Subject: Understanding of Gymnastics

When I was a level 9 gymnast 1 1/2 years ago, nobody knew the sacrafices, and
sometimes pain I went through to get to where I was, except perhaps my
coaches and my teamates. My Mom knew a little bit, because I'd talk of my
frustrations in the car. My dad knew nothing and thought all that I could do
were my level 6 routines. He wondered why he spent money on me every month,
to do dittely, and not have me home to do chores. It was very frustrating
for me, my family and friends didn't understand how hard I worked for myself,
why I couldn't make family get togethers or sleepovers with my friends. They
often thought, if you aren't olympic material, you can't do anything. I
remember one incedent at school when one of my friends said that they were
watching olympic gymnastics recently, and they asked me if that was what I
did. I said in a way, I was just doing more elementary skills. Oh, they
replied. They thought I was just learning cartwheels. For these reasons I
find my friends at the gym, my closest friends, because every day they would
experience what I did. I think gymnastics made me such a strong person
mentally, and helped me in so many ways, not just physically, It even helps
me do well in school. I wish my friends and family would have understood
what I would go through every day to get to where I was. And, I wish my dad
could understand that gymnastics is the reason for my success. Not just the
genes he passeed on to me.

-Jessica

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 25 Aug 1994 18:12:08 -0700 (PDT)
From: ***@netcom.com
Subject: Understanding of Gymnastics

Jessica mentioned the lack of understanding people have of gymnastics...

>From the post, it looked like Jessica grew up very fast due to the demands of
gymn. Sometimes this is a good thing and sometimes this is a bad thing.
You can end up trading your childhood away in return for the discipline given
you by your gymn work. You end up focused and this helps you in school and
workplace. In all, if you make it to the high levels in gymn then it ends
up worth it. People dont understand. If people not understanding you bothers
you, then maybe this trade is not as equatable. How important is doing "kid"
things? These issues should all be addressed if you decide tio get "serious"
with gymn. This decision is not to be made lightly.

My guess is the discipline & focus was a good thing for jessica.
I almost envy her. I grew up as an underachieving "smart cookie".
I am rather undisciplined. A decent gymn career might have helped me become
more focused. I am searching for this focus. Perhaps the navy will be the
answer for me.

Suggestion to Jessica and the rest of you who share this problem.
Ask "Dad" if he loves you.
Ask this person if they want to understand you.
Ask this person if they really know just what all you do.
If they dont pay attention to what you say, then go back a question and tell
them that they have made it obvious to you that they dont care about you.
You can get away with using guilt as a weapon in getting people to stop and
think how they are treating you.

When someone compares you to the olymopics, remind them that there is acres of
territory between learning cartwheels and the olympics and much of the terrain
is pretty gnarly stuff !


When Dad doesnt understand you, it really SUX !
I can see this clearly.
My Dad has been working with the same bunch of guys for 40 years.
He doesnt understand my contracting a few months here and a few there.
Similar stuff.

Guys are wired really wierd and there is no tech manual available.
I know this cause Im a guy too!

Ta ta for now !

-texx

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 25 Aug 94 12:29:27 EDT
From: ***@aol.com
Subject: unfactored scores

Hi everyone -

I unfactored the scores for the women's compulsories It's a bit easier to
tell how close (or not) compulsories were. Here you go:

1. Miller 38.80
2. Dawes 38.65
3. Borden 38.175
4. Thompson 37.45
4. Chow 37.45
6. Phelps 37.35
7. McDermott 36.825
8. Davis 36.775
9. Keiver 36.725
10. Meduna 36.65
11. Reid 36.625

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 25 Aug 1994 06:31:43 -0500 (CDT)
From: ***@owlnet.rice.edu
Subject: USAs, other compulsories

Well, no use repeating what's already been posted! So, here's the Junior men
and Senior
women. Thanks to Lisa and Mara for posting results for me, btw.

Junior Men

1, Mike Morgan, Queen City, Cincinnati, 61.32 points. 2, Mike Dutka,
Gymnastrum, Fairless Hills, Pa., 60.06. 3, Marshall Nelson, OTC, Greeley, Colo.,
59.76. 4, Aaron Vexler, Daggett's, Amhurst, Mass., 59.16. 5, Tim Elsner, World
Cup, Middletown, N.J., 57.80. 6, Andrew Pilleggi, OTC, Reno, Nevada, 57.00. 7,
Jason Katsampes, Parkettes, Hummelstown, Pa., 56.82. 8, Nate Quinn, Arizona
State, Scottsdale, Ariz., 52.68. 9, Craig Nesbitt, Springfield, Springfield Mo.,
52.14. 10, Jin Bin Im, Willmette, Skokie, Ill., 51.96.

Women's Seniors
All-Around
1, Shannon Miller, Dynamo, Edmond, Okla., 46.56 points. 2, Dominique Dawes,
Hill's Angels, Silver Spring, Md., 46.38. 3, Amanda Borden, Cincinnati Gym,
Cincinnati, 45.81. 4, Jennie Thompson, Dynamo, Wichita Falls, Texas, 44.94. Amy
Chow, West Valley, San Jose, Calif., 44.94. 6, Jaycie Phelps, Cincinnati Gym,
Greenfield, Ohio, 44.82. 7, Kristin McDermott, Parkettes, Allentown, Pa., 44.19.
8, Kellee Davis, American Twisters, Cambria Heights, N.Y., 44.13. 9, Ashley
Kever, Capital Gymnastics, Austin, Texas, 44.07. 10, Soni Meduna, Dynamo, Colon,
Neb., 43.98. 11, Summer Reid, Flips, Reno, Nevada, 43.95.

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 25 Aug 94 12:10:49 EDT
From: ***@aol.com
Subject: US compulsory scores

I found these apparatus scores in an article from the San Jose Mercury. Does
anyone have the rest of the scores? Here are the ones I have.

Miller scored 9.625 on the vault, 9.825 on the uneven bars, 9.45 on the
balance beam and a 9.9 on the floor exercise.

Daws scored a 9.725 on the vault with a 9.7 on the floor exercises, 9.65 on
the bars and 9.575 on the balance beam.

Bagiu received a 9.45 on the floor exercise, 9.20 on the pommel horse, 9.25
on the rings, 9.45 on the vault, 9.20 on the parallel bars and 9.60 on the
high bar.

That's all of the individual scores they had.

LeeAnn

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 25 Aug 94 15:37 PDT
From: ***@MVS.OAC.UCLA.EDU
Subject: Wendy Bruce

I heard that Wendy looks great but that she had problems on the beam compo
and scored only 7.85. Susan said she only had 1 fall and that the score
was too low. However, again according to Susan who is at Nationals, she had
the highest scoring vault compo at 9.75.

Kudos to Wendy!!!

Kerri is apparently not competing at this meet. I don't think she is 100%
percent back yet from her scary fall at Classic. Apparently they will
show that fall during the coverage on TV, you know, just to be extra tacky.

Hwang Bo Sil's fall at 91 Universiade is still the worst.

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 26 Aug 94 11:12:03 EDT
From: ***@MIT.EDU
Subject: Whatever happened to... (Re: Junior Nationals results)

>Hi everyone. I just got back from the optional portion of the Junior
>National Championships. As I didn't see results posted, I decided to post
>the new Junior National Team (the top 12 finishers). They didn't announce
>who came in where after the top 12. Well, here goes...

Whatever happened to Jennie Thompson? A year ago most of us would have
expected her to be high on this list...

--Robyn

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 24 Aug 1994 10:00:32 -0500 (EST)
From: ***@indiana.edu
Subject: woodward report

Well, we're back from Woodward, where it was monsoon season. We missed
Svetlana Boguinskaia (sp?) by one day. Aargh! but heard she did the lip
sinc. contest with the kids and was generally great with them.
Vitaly Sherbo who is usually unapproachable was much more human this time.
Jessamyn and her friend, Emily were playing cards and he came by and asked
if he could do some card tricks for them. He does really great card tricks!
They were tickled he noticed them.
The kids had tons of fun with a Sports Acro team from London. Has anyone
heard of Harrow's Gymnastics School?
I didn't get to meet Lisa Cozzens, but I did see her footlocker! She stayed
in the same cabin as one of my fellow Hoosiers. By the way, Lisa, if you
were in that Lip Sinc. with Joanna, you guys need to keep your day jobs.
(Just kidding!)
Jessamyn got to help Steve Elliot with a couple clinics and she had fun
with that. Plus her coaches there were the 2 crazy guys, (Ricky and Pete)
so, the kids had a great time. But, I was worn out trying to
keep track of the mini-campers and driving back and forth to State College.
I would suggest that if you decide to go to Woodward next year, don't wait
till this late in the summer. Lots of people had left and they were pretty
short staffed. Some of the college coaches who work there in the summer
had already left. Plus the kids really get a kick out of seeing the
famous gymnasts and the only one left was Vitaly.

------------------------------

End of gymn Digest
******************************