GYMN-L Digest - 24 Jul 1996 - Special issue

There are 23 messages totalling 602 lines in this issue.

Topics in this special issue:

1. Thanks from NBC (2)
2. The crowd at Georgia Dome
3. Women's Team Finals ! !
4. SPOILER - NBC's Mistake on Kerri
5. Did John Tesh make a mistake? (2)
6. Thoughts
7. various gripes about whiners
8. NBC versus the BBC
9. Stop NBC bashing please!
10. Strug Floor score?????? (2)
11. Dom M. in the AA
12. Moceanu's FX
13. Results and more results
14. Kerri's Floor Score
15. At The Olympics, July 23
16. 0.2 deductions
17. NBC versus BBC (2)
18. GYMN-L Digest - 23 Jul 1996 - Special issue
19. a sincere thanks :)

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Date: Wed, 24 Jul 1996 07:58:10 -0400
From: ***@AOL.COM
Subject: Thanks from NBC

I want to thank everyone who has sent such kind comments to me about our
coverage. I'm sorry I haven't had time to answer everyone personally. I know
it's not cool to go public with your comments! But the positive reinforcement
from you Gymners has been great. I know why you can't post in public.

To the naysayers, I'm glad you have a forum to vent.

I wish we could show everyone's routines. It broke my heart not to be able to
show more of the Russians and Romanians last night. But to anyone in the
Georgia Dome it was clear that there was one main story going on. I wish we
had twice the program time.

Thanks to everyone who were moved by the Romanian story. I'll pass along all
your wishes to Octavian Belu. The deluge of mail about Arkaev will make him
laugh.

I'll try and answer more of your notes personally after the All-Around. But
thanks again for letting us know that you're enjoying the coverage.

Maybe a few of you could go public. Reading the public posts it seems like
the group isn't happy with the coverage!!!!!

David Michaels
NBC Sports
from the Dome Parking Lot.

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Date: Wed, 24 Jul 1996 08:25:13 -0400
From: ***@GRFN.ORG
Subject: Re: The crowd at Georgia Dome

For what it is worth, the crowd was acknowledging the other
athletes. I heard distinct applause for other gymnasts. It's
just it wasn't as loud as for the Americans. The crowd noise
was outrageously fun for me, and I think part of the joy of
th evening. The crowd was just not paying attention much
to anyone else, but there was applause.

I'm more annoyed with NBC.

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Date: Wed, 24 Jul 1996 08:35:16 -0400
From: ***@GRFN.ORG
Subject: Re: Women's Team Finals ! !

This seemed a good place to say something about Kerri.

I sobbed for the last 15 minutes. I too knew ahead of time who
won, thanks to NBC news. But noone mentioned anything about the
way it happened.

I saw the US come out and hit bars for all it was worth (and in
the shuffle, we seem to have lost Amy Chow made bars finals, well
deserved). Then they went to beam, the place where they had their
only problem Sunday. Amanda had the BEST beam set I have ever seen
her do. Period. Everyone else hit. Kerri and Dominique stuck or
almost stuck their dismounts. The lead increased.

Then came floor. Jaycie hit a great set. Amanda did the same. Then
the roof almost came off the colisium when Moceanu's Devil danced.
She was beautiful, folks. Then Dominique Dawes hit. Shannon's score
was thrown out because of the low landing on the double layout,
but then, with the stage to herself, everyone else got to watch
Kerri Strug hit an absolutely eneergized floor set. She has grown
up so much in the last four years. I've never seen Kerri that happy.

Everyone knows what happened on vault, so I won't repeat it. But
I startde crying, and couldn't stop without a big effort. I told
myself that probably half of Kerri's tears were terror and fear that
"Oh, my god, I finally did it, but what else did I do?" I
sincerely hope she can make it to at least event finals. She earned
it last night, with perhaps the finest moment of her career.

May many more follow for her, hopefully in Atlanta.

Jenny, who noticed that it was Shannon helping Kerri on and off
the medal stand last night.

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Date: Wed, 24 Jul 1996 08:21:42 -0400
From: ***@GRFN.ORG
Subject: Re: SPOILER - NBC's Mistake on Kerri

It's very possible that NBC just screwed up too (though you think
not showing it live would allow for a correction here). They could've
counted the Russians scores wrong, etc. But my major complaint is
this...did we EVER get Kerri's floor score or Dominique Moceanu's
beam score?

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Date: Wed, 24 Jul 1996 08:42:30 -0400
From: ***@GRFN.ORG
Subject: Re: Thanks from NBC

Actually, I don't know about going public, but I would
like to offer a suggestion. Last night, we spent a lot of
time focusing on the athletes in between scores and then
with a piece on the ROmanians, which I believe had been
run earlier. Is there any way to tighten this up so that
we can get a few extra routines?

Also, PLEASE, SHOW SCORES! None of the list, I believe, knows
what Moceanu got on beam, or what Kerri scored on floor. It
only takes a few seconds, and I KNOW we could have fit it in
last night.

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Date: Wed, 24 Jul 1996 08:52:02 -0400
From: ***@GROVE.IUP.EDU
Subject: Did John Tesh make a mistake?

I'm not sure if I heard correctly or not, I was so excited that the USA won, but
when the WAG team got their medals, did John Tesh say that Amy Chow was team
captain? I thought Amanda Borden was team captain.

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Date: Wed, 24 Jul 1996 09:03:39 -0400
From: ***@MINDSPRING.COM
Subject: Thoughts

First, I'd like to note that, although the U.S. win was 100% a TEAM
effort, the heroes were:
Kerri Strug - 'nuff said
Dominique Dawes - this girl is ignored almost as much as Kerri
Amanda Borden - that solid starting beam routine caught on

the three most ignored of the Mag 7

As for the fans, I was up in the nosebleed seats. I screamed for the
Americans and jumped out of my seat often, but I also cheered
thunderously for many other atheletes and was not alone. I do plan on
sending an appreciation letter to some of the other gymnasts, like
Khorkina, but I can say that Mo, Boginskaya and Onodi got more than
their fair share too.

I should add, it wasn't that people didn't appreciate their
performances, it was a logistical nightmare to catch their performances
without missing the U.S. ones.

[the other] Jeff
--
--- Jeff
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Date: Wed, 24 Jul 1996 09:14:11 -0400
From: ***@TRISTATE.PGH.NET
Subject: various gripes about whiners

At 11:51 PM 7/23/96 -0600, you wrote:
>That was the most disgraceful exhibition I have ever seen. I now understand
>(or hope) that the IOC will never allow the USA to host these games again.
>What happened in that Dome between the commentators and the fans was
>down right RUDE.
>You could see by the faces of the Russian and Romanian teams that they were
>not happy and with their treatment from the crowd. If they watch the NBC tapes,
>they will not be happy with them, either.
>
>This sickens me. It really does. People may say USA deserved their moment,
>but not like this. I would have been alot happier had the crowd and NBC
>acknowledged the other athletes and maybe gave the whole thinga sense of
>dignity. What was shown was, basically, a camcordered taped version of the
>parenst of Team USA competing. There is no difference between what we
>saw tonight and a pee-wee baseball game.
>
>My heart went out to Kerri. But I felt more for the tears of Roza and her
>teammates. I really did.
>
>>BTW: This *IS* an American thing. In 1980, the crowds cheered for Nadia in
>AA and booed her low score of beam which lost her the gold. In Barcelona,
>the crowds cheered for the other teams. Even the non-medal teams. They
>Cheered for everyone. What you saw in that crowd and what NBC only showed
>you was plain not right.
>
>
>Jeff, who is sending a copy of this post to NBC.
>
I am so sick of hearing all of the complaining going on on this list. The
people on this list probably represent 1% of the serious gymnastics fans in
the world and that IS NOT NBCs TARGET AUDIENCE. The average US viewer...AND
NBC IS A US BROADCASTING COMAPNY...watches gymnastics during the Olympics
and not much more than that. These people do not know much about gymnastics
and probably don't care much about the other countries, this may be sad to
you, but it is true.
And the fact that Bela...and others were coaching from the barrier, so
what!!! It is not like all of the Russians ans Romanians even HAVE
individual coaches that they leave behind. They are coached by one person,
not 5 individual coaches.
As for the American fans screaming the whole time....I AM SO SORRY THAT
AMERICANS ARE MORE LIVELY than the quasi-dead crowd in Barcelona, which may
have cheered in an unpartisan way, but the whole time they sounded like they
were cheering for a badminton match.
I don't know how anyone can feel worse for the tears of the Russians than
for a gymnast in pain either. I am sorry that only one team could win the
gold, but in Barcelona when the American's finished what people considered
to be a disappointing 3rd...I didn't see them bawling all over the
place!!!!! Part of competition is losing too. The US DESERVED THIS. I am
sorry that the Romanians drew the first comp rotation, but it happens.
And compared to all of the 9.9s and 10.0s that were flying around in
Barcelona, I think that the scoring here was much more consistent and
correct. The US was not overscored nor were the others underscored. If
anything, some of the US scores DID seem to be too low.
In closing, I have just one thing to say....SUCK IT UP AND QUIT WHINING!!!!!
LMM
Flame at will, but privately please.

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Date: Wed, 24 Jul 1996 14:11:43 PDT
From: ***@WLV.AC.UK
Subject: NBC versus the BBC

Hate to be really smug here but if y'all come to the British Isles you will
notice that
our coverage is a tad better than NBC's seems. I have only ever seen one NBC
item: the Olympic Trials and 'nuff said, but it was a treat in itself to turn
over Cable
and find the broadcast in full flow.

We were treated to nearly 4 hours of top-class team gymnastics last night and
although we did not see the Romanians on their 4th rotation (bars) there was
lots of
Chinese, some views of the Russians and all this interlaced with some of that
clever virtual reality of the events from the gymnasts eye (first seen during
the
coverage of the Europeans)

Oh - and NO advertising breaks.

What do the other British subscribers to this list think?

Vic

;-)

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Date: Wed, 24 Jul 1996 09:16:56 -0400
From: ***@GNN.COM
Subject: Re: Stop NBC bashing please!

>NBC did an awesome job at
>covering the games in the little amount of time that they had.

170+ hours?!

Seriously, though, yesterday morning they had three hours 10am to 1pm of
coverage and chose to show...rowing. Not even a final, a heat for those who
had failed to qualify the first time around...wow.

It would have been a perfect time to show excerpts from the gymn competition
which was happening BEHIND THE BACKS of Tim D. and Elfi when they
interviewed them. Then on the evening news you could see Boginskaya on bars
on a tv screen behind someone being interviewed about something.

I love what NBC showed, and am grateful for it. But I want more.

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Date: Wed, 24 Jul 1996 09:39:10 -0400
From: ***@TRISTATE.PGH.NET
Subject: Strug Floor score??????

Does ANYONE know what Kerri's floor ex score was??? And I found out that
Mocs BB score was a 9.85.

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Date: Wed, 24 Jul 1996 09:40:38 -0400
From: ***@GROVE.IUP.EDU
Subject: Dom M. in the AA

Did Dom M. qualify for AA?

If she did, I don't think that she will do well. Two sit downs on vault make me
think that her leg is really starting to hurt her.

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Date: Wed, 24 Jul 1996 14:47:55 +0100
From: ***@ACHILLES.DEMON.CO.UK
Subject: Moceanu's FX

Could one of the group's qualified judges give us a run-down of how
Dominique Moceanu's FX came to be scored at 9.837?

Was it because she's a better tumbler than Chusovitina? Or because she's
a better interpreter of her music than Juarez? Or because she's a more
expressive dancer than any of the French girls?

Or was there some other reason?

--
Frances

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Date: Wed, 24 Jul 1996 10:38:53 -0400
From: ***@LEARN.SENECAC.ON.CA
Subject: Results and more results

Congratulations to the US Women's Gymnasts!


Take a look at

http://www.senecac.on.ca/~snysp/sp1.htm#Olympic

for more links carrying this and other Olympic stories!


Happy Watching!

Mike

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Date: Wed, 24 Jul 1996 14:51:10 PDT
From: ***@WLV.AC.UK
Subject: Re: Kerri's Floor Score

Strugg scored 9.837, equal to Dom Moc. I found this on one of the many web pages
so dunno how correct it is!!!

Vic

;-)

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Date: Wed, 24 Jul 1996 11:03:29 -0400
From: ***@UMICH.EDU
Subject: Re: Strug Floor score??????

Strug's floor routine was a 9.825 which qualified her for floor finals...

> Does ANYONE know what Kerri's floor ex score was??? And I found out that
> Mocs BB score was a 9.85.
>

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Date: Wed, 24 Jul 1996 11:22:09 -0400
From: "***@AOL.COM
Subject: At The Olympics, July 23

To All:
On one of the roads leading into Atlanta, there is a sign celebrating
the Olympic spectators. It says:
"Ever see an entire stadium out of control?"
Tonight, I did.
I had the extremely good fortune of witnessing what likely will become
the most remembered moment of the 1996 Olympics. I watched U.S. Gymnast Kerri
Strug ignore pain and throw her second vault to help win the United States
its first gold medal ever in women s Olympic gymnastics.
By now, you probably already have seen the images on your television
screen. You ve seen the pictures of Kerri being carried to and from the gold
medal stand by her coach, Bela Karoyli. And you ve seen the pictures, again
and again, of her landing the second vault, then having the will to salute
the judges before crumpling to the floor in pain.
But what you did not see is the reaction in the crowd. You didn t see
the woman near me jump up in joy, only to send the camera in her lap flying
down the stairs. You did not see total strangers high-fiving each other. You
did not see men and women alike with tears flowing down their cheeks. You did
not see little kids stamping their feet and dancing jigs of joy.
You didn t see 40,000 people, in a sea of humanity, all walking down the
main Olympic Avenue afterwards, talking about nothing but "The Vault." You
did not see how the normally quiet and packed transit busses came alive with
people of all countries talking about Kerri.
As I sat through all of this, I kept wondering how many people really
understood what they had witnessed. Not too long ago, I was at a history
making event, and it wasn t until later that I realized the weight of what I
had seen.
Five years ago, I had the good fortune of being at the World Gymnastics
Championship in Indianapolis and watching U.S. Gymnast Kim Zmeskal become the
first ever American to win the gold medal in the all-around at a World
Championships.
The funny part is that I don t remember a whole lot of what I did when
Kim landed her final floor pass to win the all-around title.
It wasn t until HBO aired a special on Kim that I saw exactly what I
did. I had seats very close to the competition floor, so when a gymnast was
shown on television on the floor routine, you could see me in the background.
On the HBO special, when Kim is shown landing her last pass, you can see me
in the background, jumping extremely high into the air.
Then I jumped several more times, mouthing something to my friend, even
high-fiving him. I was still standing and cheering and waving wildly when she
Kim walking off the floor. I was witnessing history but didn t realize it.
Tonight, though, I did. And that has made it all the more special.
It is now nearly 2 a.m. as I write this, and I m still wide awake and
flowing with adrenaline. I feel extremely privileged just to be at the
Olympics but to see Kerri do what she did tonight makes my Olympic experience
all that more wonderful.
Somebody once said, "May you live in interesting times." It was meant as
an insult, a way of saying you hope somebody would face hard times. But that
quote has always intrigued me. I like to think of it as a way to wish
somebody well.
After all, wouldn t it be great to live in times that are ever-changing,
ever-challenging and full of wonder? Tonight, I experienced just a tiny slice
of such a life. It s something that will stay with me always. It s something
that I wish everybody could experience.
May you live in interesting times.
-- Ron, From Atlanta
(A complete list of cool Olympics sites -- including videos, virtual reality,
sounds, photos -- can be found at: http://www.charlotte-florida.com/olympics)

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Date: Wed, 24 Jul 1996 11:17:55 -0400
From: ***@IC.AC.UK
Subject: 0.2 deductions

This is a forwarded message from Sarah Hazelwood who is having problems
with posting to Gymn at the moment:

Subject "0.2 deductions"

The 0.2 deduction for not being American and competing at the Olympics in
Atlanta....in a team event is this deduction per person, or per team?

If it were per person, then per team that would mean a 1.0 deduction, in
which case if this deduction was not made Russia would have claimed team
gold!


Sarah :)

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Date: Wed, 24 Jul 1996 11:20:56 -0400
From: ***@IC.AC.UK
Subject: Re: NBC versus BBC

Another forwarded message from Sarah:

From: ***@sun1.gl.rhbnc.ac.uk (

subject NBC versus BBC

We Brits may no get much coverage on the BBC...only major events like
worlds, and olympics, but as stated before there are no commercial breaks,
and because or gymnasts don't have much chance of medals they are not
concentrated. Hence we get coverage of many gymnasts from other countries
that have the chance of medals. I have to say our commentators sound
beeter that the USA ones do, I could listen to Mitch Fenner for hours. He
has a soft to that doesn't grate your ears, he's knowledgeable ablut moves
and of happenings in the gym world that entertain us gym fanatics as well
as those less knowledgeable types.

Sarah :)

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Date: Wed, 24 Jul 1996 11:39:23 -0400
From: ***@CORNELL.EDU
Subject: Re: Did John Tesh make a mistake?

At 08:52 7/24/96 -0400, you wrote:
>I'm not sure if I heard correctly or not, I was so excited that the USA
won, but
> when the WAG team got their medals, did John Tesh say that Amy Chow was team
> captain? I thought Amanda Borden was team captain.

That's what he said... given that it was pointed out to us two days
ago that Borden had been named captain by the others, I didn't think that
point would be slipped up on, but it's also probably one of the easiest
things to miss from memory (or if the wrong thing came up on the monitor).

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Date: Wed, 24 Jul 1996 11:47:51 -0400
From: ***@AOL.COM
Subject: Re: GYMN-L Digest - 23 Jul 1996 - Special issue


<< ... Russia - stunning ... USA - pretty overscored ... Germany
- Wecker at his steroid-best ... Korea - best vaulters in the world
>>

I agree with you that Russia was stunning. I would also point out that 4 of
the top 8 optional scores in Vault were EARNED BY THE RUSSIANS; I guess
you're pretty far off regarding Korea, as well as some of your other remarks
above.

Your crack about Wecker is pretty serious and certainly not funny; there is
little humorous about drug abuse or allegations thereof. Do you have
evidence of this implication, or are you merely surmising steroid use, or do
you simply trying to be clever?

I assume that you are quite knowledgeable on the rules of gymnastics, with
extensive experience in their application, to make the statement about the US
guys being overscored.
NO? Well, as a 20 year FIG Brevet (International) rated judge, let me set
you straight.
I sat and judged every routine that I saw on TV, a habit that I am unable to
break. What I found was that the judging was VERY strict; NO ONE got a break
on anything. Even on the events where we had friends or USA officials
judging, we got no breaks. AND THAT IS THE WAY IT IS SUPPOSED TO BE!

I am sick of any and all of the people who can find nothing good to say about
our Men's Team, but always have the baseless glib remark or the unfounded
criticism. This is a truly unique and special group of young men, tough as
hell, and dedicated to representing their country to the best of their
ability. Their success this year was that THEY brought our Men's Program to
the brink of International success. They won't get a medal for what they
have accomplished or what they have given the sport, but, for this group of
guys, I think they will get a lifelong satisfaction from knowing that THEY
opened the way for our future.

It has been great to see so many messages of congratulations for these guys,
many coming from people who didn't believe in this team in the beginning. I
know it means a lot to them to have the community's RESPECT. It has been a
great year for gymnastics with a solid Men's Team for the first time in years
and the incredible, tough, Gold Medal winning Women's Team. They have laid
the foundation for the future; it is up to us to produce the kind of gymnasts
and teach the kind of gymnastics which will move us on to even greater
successes.

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Date: Wed, 24 Jul 1996 16:46:33 PDT
From: ***@WLV.AC.UK
Subject: NBC versus BBC

I'm very much a less knowlegable type and also love Mitch. Bless........

Any views from any other lucky people who recieve the BBC? (even 'though we are
charged #84 odd a year for the privilege)

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Date: Wed, 24 Jul 1996 09:22:14 -0700
From: ***@NETCOM.COM
Subject: a sincere thanks :)

This is from my fellow group of "lurkers", to all those marvelous people
who have reported in on how the gymnasts from the other countries
performed (NBC: What? There were other gymnasts and people actually
want to know about them? <g>)

Yeah...I know...how un-American, I actually did want to know about the
Chinese, Austrailians and French.

Thanks again....Nanci

Don't wanna study! Wanna suf the net!

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End of GYMN-L Digest - 24 Jul 1996 - Special issue
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